Episode 950- Master Chris Rappold

In today's episode Jeremy sits down with Master Chris Rappold of Team Paul Mitchell.

Master Chris Rappold - Episode 950

SUMMARY
In this conversation, Jeremy Lesniak is joined by Master Chris Rappold and he discuss the impact of martial arts training on individuals and families. Master Rappold talks about the power of martial arts to change lives and the joy of seeing students bring their own children to train. He also discusses the importance of creating a family atmosphere in martial arts schools and the benefits of teaching personal development alongside physical techniques. Master Rappold shares his journey of starting his own school and the challenges and successes he experienced. He also touches on the topics of progressive resistance, effort and results, and the value of acknowledging students' efforts. In this conversation, Master Rappold and Jeremy discuss the importance of setting goals, embracing failure, and continuously learning in martial arts and life. He shares personal stories and insights from his experiences in competition and training. The conversation highlights the value of perseverance, self-discipline, and the pursuit of excellence. Master Rappold emphasizes the need to set tangible goals and celebrate successes along the way, while Jeremy emphasizes the importance of embracing discomfort and continuous growth. They also express admiration for martial artists who constantly seek new challenges and opportunities for improvement.

TAKEAWAYS
* Martial arts training can have a profound impact on individuals and families, shaping character and providing valuable life lessons.
* Creating a family atmosphere in martial arts schools can foster a sense of community and connection among students.
* Teaching personal development alongside physical techniques can enhance the benefits of martial arts training.
* Starting a martial arts school requires passion, perseverance, and a willingness to learn from others.
* Acknowledging students' efforts and providing progressive resistance can help build confidence and develop important life skills. Setting tangible goals and celebrating successes along the way is important for growth and progress.
* Embracing failure and learning from it is a valuable lesson in martial arts and life.
* Continuous learning and seeking new challenges are essential for personal and professional growth.
* Perseverance and self-discipline are key qualities in martial arts and achieving success.
* The pursuit of excellence requires embracing discomfort and continuously pushing oneself to improve.

CHAPTERS
00:00 Introduction and Overview
04:36 Creating a Family Atmosphere in Martial Arts Schools
08:36 Starting a Martial Arts School: Challenges and Successes
13:05 The Importance of Progressive Resistance and Effort
19:05 Acknowledging Students' Efforts and Building Confidence
35:45 The Importance of Setting Tangible Goals
39:07 Embracing Failure and Learning from It
44:10 Continuous Learning and Seeking New Challenges
51:23 Perseverance and Self-Discipline in Martial Arts
56:26 The Pursuit of Excellence and Embracing Discomfort

Show Notes

To contact Master Chris Rappold: www.chrisrappold.com

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Show Transcript

Jeremy (00:00.468)

Hey, what's going on everybody? Welcome. You're tuned in to Whistlekick martial arts radio and on today's episode I'm joined by Chris Rappold. We're gonna have a great chat I've been looking forward to this one for a while and so stick around if you're new to the show Please head on over to whistlekick martial arts radio .com show notes transcripts all that good stuff stuff that you would expect stuff that you wouldn't expect and if you're not Checking out what we have there. You're missing out if you're not checking out what we have a whistle kick calm your

Definitely missing out because what we do here to connect educate and entertain the traditional martial arts the world is a lot more than this show We have events we have apparel in the shirts, you know, we're retired but you know, we do stuff like that and it's all because We believe as an organization that six months of martial arts training can change someone's life And what if we get everybody to do that we can change the world. So if that resonates for you help us in our mission Chris

Thank you for helping us in our mission by being here.

Chris (01:02.827)

It's my pleasure and you know that little bit that you did is quite an introduction and I applaud your thought process as far as six months of martial arts. I think that's so...

Jeremy (01:16.298)

How many times have you heard that though? Somebody comes up to you, they find out that you teach, you train, you coach, and they say, know, I did six months of whatever when I was a kid, and I know it made such an impact on me. I want my kid to do karate, taekwondo, whatever.

Chris (01:33.015)

Yeah, it happens frequently. It happens often. I will maybe one up that or just validate that, which is now doing this going into my 33rd year. I have my students now bringing their children. You know, they grew up in my school and now they're bringing their children and there's never a greater validation of what it is

we do then when somebody says I want my son, want my daughter to experience the same thing, to hear the same lessons, to go through the same victories and struggles that I did because it helped to mold my character. And this is what I want to provide them to get them ready for whatever life holds for them.

Jeremy (02:26.176)

That is the best kind of one -upsmanship, right? Like that is such a powerful thing and you know, I haven't been teaching long enough to have that experience but I've talked to people who have worked with two, three, even four generations in a family and it doesn't seem to be that there's anything they take more pride in. know, yeah.

Chris (02:28.897)

Yeah.

Chris (02:43.129)

for it.

Jeremy (02:52.842)

Competitive success of students is great. Yeah advancing students to certain ranks is great but when someone pays you that ultimate compliment of you changed my life in this way this limited time my child has I want them to spend some of it with

Chris (03:07.919)

Mm

Yeah, yeah, it's really powerful. you know, when you look at all of the different events and activities, are, there's so few that generations can do together. Speaking from my, you know, my own family, my, my mom, my ex -wife, my children, my nieces, my nephews, you know, everybody.

in my family has somehow some way been connected, you know, in martial arts and it's, you know, it creates such a bond and, you know, you're going to look back and we're going to all have memories of our life and to be able to say, you know, you've got to spend, you know, hundreds or thousands of hours on the mat with my grandmother

my mother or my father, you know, my brother, sister, it's, that's, that's the stuff that money can't buy, you know, it's, it's, it's precious.

Jeremy (04:19.562)

Yeah, yeah, some of the most successful martial arts schools I've seen embrace that and have like a family style class. I don't know if you do that. It's something that we do in my school. And I've seen schools that it's the heart of what they

Chris (04:34.647)

Yeah. It is it. You know, I was talking to my team the other day and I said, I have long since become bored with teaching our first form, which is Chunji. OK. Years ago, I mean, I've taught it tens of thousands of times and I'm bored of teaching it. Yes, that's all I was teaching.

Jeremy (04:36.136)

And it's so powerful to watch.

Jeremy (05:03.104)

So I could get you to tune out.

Chris (05:04.815)

Yeah, yeah, totally. Yeah, look at you. You're doing the arm movements. You know the form. Down one block punch, down one block punch, you know. But the reason after this is my 42nd year as a martial artist, the reason that you can stick me on the floor with a rambunctious four -year -old or, you know, put me with a world -class martial art athlete and I'm equally as happy is when I'm teaching.

Jeremy (05:09.998)

huh. I know.

Chris (05:35.207)

I'm looking at the bigger picture of the benefits that they're receiving. I'm looking at just the postural change that they're making, you know, with their shoulders. I'm looking at the confidence that they have to take on to be successful at the particular move. I'm looking at them breaking down their fears or facing their fears head on using

you know, you know, gentle progressive resistance to get them to the point that you can go full force and it's not a big deal to them. If it was purely a physical, I'm teaching a physical memorized pattern and that was it. I would have been out of it a long time ago because I would have been so bored. But now, you know, 33 years later as a teacher,

I just, I'm as happy today teaching and seeing what our program does for people as I was that very first class that I taught with one boy who enrolled in my program. And I remember him and as excited as I was to open personal best and teach him, I'm that excited when I walk on the floor.

Jeremy (07:00.48)

How did you end up starting your school? it something you'd always wanted to do or did circumstances create

Chris (07:06.893)

Hmm.

Chris (07:10.627)

Well, I think we were both lucky in that we were able to turn what was a started out as a hobby into a career. I went to college and I graduated with a degree in exercise physiology and Bridgewater State University. Well, was Bridgewater State College at the time, university now and I

Jeremy (07:25.492)

Where did you come?

Chris (07:37.655)

With I graduated in May and then in July I opened personal best with absolutely to say I didn't know what I was doing. I would say I was below zero if that's possible. So I knew how to I knew karate and I had absolutely no business background whatsoever. I nothing about a a professional.

you know, how to run a professional school. I just had my mind set on, you know, if I could, you know, based on the rent that I was paying, which I think was $900 at the time, if I, okay, if I can get like 12 students, I got my rent covered. And if I, you know, could ever get up to 40 or 50 students, I'd be set for life. You know, I mean, this is, this is living large.

Jeremy (08:35.645)

Where was your school?

Chris (08:35.759)

You know, that it well, my my schools have always been about 45 minutes south of Boston, about 20 minutes, 25 minutes north of Providence. So we were in that little corridor between the two of them. And the first school was in Easton, EASTON mass. And yeah, you know, that's that's how it started. It was just, let's you know, I want to do this and and

just opened the doors and that was it. And then through the good graces of a lot of people and God and probably a lot of just fortune that I don't even recognize, was able to get around people that knew a lot more about what I didn't know than I did at the time. And I just started to mentor with them.

And it made such a difference. The other thing too is, and I don't think this can be understated, I had the sliver of time where I was coming in after the karate kid. I was coming in around the time of the Ninja Turtles and the Power Rangers. So at the time there was an explosion like nothing we had ever seen. It was 1991, so late

you know, I think started the explosion, it was still, you know, it was still quite, you know, I had good fortune. had the, you know, it's kind of like if you buy a stock and the whole market is going up, you think you're a genius. You don't realize you're just, you're just being carried, you know, and so I think I have to acknowledge that in fairness, for whatever the reason it was, it turned out to be good.

Jeremy (10:21.094)

True story.

Jeremy (10:34.25)

Hmm. So you open that day in July and for those of you, because I've learned there's there are regional differences with this. For those of you who don't know, starting something that is even at least partially focused on children in New England in July isn't necessarily a great choice.

Chris (10:55.961)

Right? Yeah.

Jeremy (10:59.22)

But there you are, you're doing it, you've got this one boy that shows up and then what? Did it grow quickly or did you struggle?

Chris (11:07.693)

Yeah, you know, well, I was living at my friend's and I was cleaning, I was living at my friend's mother's house, I should say. And I was cleaning the house in exchange for rent. So my overhead was extremely low and I was very,

you know, grateful for that. I opened the school with $700 in the bank. So I, and my rent was $900. Though I want to say I might've had a month or two of free rent. So, you know, the time clock was ticking. But, and also at the time, not knowing anything, we had a supermarket across the street from our school. So I spent my time.

littering their parking lot with flyers that I would put. Again, this is, you know, 33 years ago. I would put them on the windshields of cars. And yeah, I mean, to say that now, I almost feel embarrassed because it sounds offensive. know, you're just at least in this area of the world, you just don't do that. But at the time, you know,

Jeremy (12:17.884)

because you could do that back then.

Chris (12:33.763)

there was myself and there were other businesses that were doing that and that was okay, which was fortunate because I didn't have an advertising budget. But I took advantage of what was around me, which was a supermarket that had pulled a lot of people close to my school. yeah, and I have to say it did grow. And I remember back then if I placed an ad, we would get seven calls, we

up to 14 calls, you know, for placing an ad, which is why I say I had some luck on my side coming off of the karate kid because that's not the reality anymore. At least not in my world, it's not. You know, so again, good fortune. you know, the other thing that I would say is, you know, we always have, we have two things.

polar opposites that we all have in life and that is the good fortune of having people to show you what to do and the good fortune of people to show you what not to do. So I had come from a very competitive martial arts school and you know at the time I don't think you know my teacher emotionally was in a very good place in his life so I remember all of the things that he did that I didn't like.

And I just did the opposite and people seem to really like and enjoy it. So he had a, he had a hand in helping me, you know, just through his, his poor example. but yeah, it was, it was, it was a combination of doing that. And then I, know, I would, I would give a nod to my upbringing as well. you know, I was taught right from wrong and I was, I was taught to be

you know, would hope a thoughtful, caring, kind person. I think I've always naturally gravitated to being an energy giver. So I combine those things with my love of physical martial arts at the time. And then it was the exposure to other people that were talking about all of the additional benefits somebody could gain from

Chris (15:00.243)

a lifestyle of martial arts as opposed to simply a competitive outlet. that was very rewarding. And that was my excitement and my enthusiasm started to almost rise to the level of equaling, that same level of excitement I had

you know, competitiveness.

Yeah.

Jeremy (15:32.212)

What were some of the, if I'd watched your school in the early years, what were some of those adjustments that maybe happened as you embraced that side of training and living a martial arts lifestyle?

Chris (15:46.171)

I I had started to weave in from a very early on, probably not quite from the beginning, early on taking the sayings, taking the mindset of the personal development side of thinking and combining

in the form of, you know, writing quotes on a whiteboard or talking to people about the importance of, you know, eating healthy and, you know, saying great instead of good and creating self -discipline habits of, you know, fixing your bed, fixing, know, fixing your bed was the first thing that I started with, you know, we all know it's easy to do, it's easy not to do. And

Chris (16:46.263)

You know, it just, it was an interesting metaphor for me to prove to a parent that, again, this has gone back a long time, but what I could potentially bring their child outside of just a physical outlet, but I could actually influence them by assigning them the task of fixing their bed.

and the parents were amazed that they would actually follow through. You and I both know, sometimes you can say the same thing a parent says, but because of the familiarity a child has with a parent, sometimes it just goes right in one ear and out the other. But when somebody on the outside validates a habit, a thought

that a parent has been saying, all of a sudden it clicks and, you know, bringing a report card that you're not proud of to your parent is one thing, bringing it to your martial art instructor, well, that's a whole nother thing, you know. So it was those things early on that I started to weave in from the knowledge base that I had from the personnel development.

that I had been exposed to that I started to bring in and craft into the program. And now that's, you know, I'd like to say that's more commonplace in the martial arts world. I think there's, you know, as I've traveled around and had the privilege of going into probably hundreds of martial arts schools now,

Jeremy (18:26.056)

It is, I'd say.

Chris (18:39.587)

I've seen it, you it's on a continuum. Some people are magical at delivering the message and some people, you know, they make the attempt, which is good, but it's, you know, there might be a couple things missing for it to really have the impact that it could have, but, you know, I applaud them for making the

Jeremy (19:04.84)

Yeah, it's, you know, kind of going back to how we open this idea that martial arts has such substantial benefits that a child is going to remember those, right? If it was just the physical stuff, if it was just the punching and the kicking, kids gonna think about it in terms of fun. They're gonna look back and say, you know, it got me moving. You know, we're old enough now that nobody

was really concerned about kids needing to get up off the couch and move, right? You know, it's something that we talk about with today's youth. But we're gonna think about it in the same way that we might think about football or soccer or baseball. So having those other elements in there, it's almost like you can't help but find that personal growth because of the process that we use, that constant, you you're never done.

Chris (19:36.909)

Right.

Jeremy (20:02.024)

Right? You've taught Chung -Ji, we'll say, tens of thousands of times, maybe a hundred thousand times. And if we were to describe that action outside of martial arts, everyone would agree you are expert level perfect. But I bet if you watched you teaching Chung -Ji on a video from yesterday, you would say,

Chris (20:10.179)

Probably.

Jeremy (20:31.348)

I could do that a little better. You know, I didn't mention that or, you know what? I can see where the students are not understanding, their attention's drifting, right? There's always something to improve within what we do. And I think that it's that very nature that makes what we do so special and so

Chris (20:33.195)

my goodness.

Chris (20:51.395)

Well, I think, you know, on that point, I agree with you because I look at in the sport of sport karate, which I come from, the difference between first and second or first and fourth could be half a second, right? It's a very subjective sport. It's who hits who hardest in first

what judge has the particular angle to be able to see the effectiveness. You know, there's all of those things. So there's a level of, know, right, wrong, or indifferent is a level of perfection that has to be applied. And we're always looking for that one little advantage to really, you know, solidify consistency over time in that sport.

I bring the same level of passion to teaching. And I think the teachers that I have modeled, and I'll use Chris's words to describe what I see, is the teachers that I admire the most, they have an ability to meet a student where they're at, number one. So they're not gonna force feed.

what they're good at to a student that doesn't have the physical ability or mental maturity to be able to handle that yet. So wherever they're at, three years, four years, five years, physical, mental disabilities, injuries, age, et cetera, they're going to PTSD, depression, anxiety,

You know, all of these things that it's just commonplace for us to come face to face with every day. These teachers are going to meet them where they're at. They're going to gain a level of trust and rapport with that student. But you first have to, you have to know how to go there and you know, you have to know how to unlock

Chris (23:17.971)

And I'm not sure you could read a book on it or say, well, to create rapport with people, do step one, step two, step three. Well, that will work for that middle section of the world. But the people on the outer extremes, and I would argue the people that really need something like martial arts, you have to have that gift.

So we meet them where they're at and then from there at a pace that they can handle and that's where we provide, you we use the term progressive resistance. We start as their confidence builds physically and mentally, we start to gradually bring them up to a level of proficiency that will work against, you know, a resisting opponent or work against a level

work against a level of mental resistance that they're going to have in life. They're going to need to understand how to deal with somebody not loving them the way their mom and dad does, or they're gonna need to learn how to deal with a defeat on the basketball team or whatever. it's, I think it goes back to being able to meet them where they're at.

adding that level of progressive resistance and building their confidence over time. I believe in a transfer effect. don't, I think if you can show someone success in a particular discipline, and the one we're talking about right now is martial arts, and if you can show them how to take themselves from where they are by coming alongside them.

in showing them how they can earn a level of proficiency. You're teaching them a whole lot more than martial arts because you're showing them how to approach anything. As you're probably aware, sometimes we see people and we just have to be careful of this. We have to be careful of this as martial artists.

Chris (25:42.649)

I think we have to be careful of this as friends. think we have to be careful of this as parents, but to use a martial art metaphor, because you award somebody a stripe on their belt or a belt, and you say that is what's building the child's confidence, that's lunacy. The only power the belt has is

Chris (26:12.341)

the intelligence of the person receiving the belt, knowing what they did to earn the belt. So if you try to shortcut and you look at the belt hierarchy and you say, this is a way to retain and motivate my students is I'm going to give them tips and belts. You're missing the whole point of it. The analogy.

I don't know, Jeremy, what would be the analogy of a parent trying to shortcut that? It's like giving a child free access to a credit card or something like that. You know, like, okay, how is that going to... Okay, so you gave them the reward of free access to your credit card, but they never understood.

Jeremy (26:53.669)

I was thinking something around, yeah, yeah, around allowance.

Chris (27:10.157)

the value of money. They never understood the responsibility of earning. They've never had the lesson of the responsibility of saving, of prioritizing where they're going to allocate their money. So giving them the gift does not, you know, it's not, you put two children side by side, one that had to go through the lessons to get the credit card and then one that was given a credit card.

It's just not the same thing.

Jeremy (27:41.992)

I believe a lot of the challenges we have right now in the world, we have parents having children and many of those parents were raised in a way where they did not get to connect effort with results. And that's everything I'm hearing you talk about. if you, not that a lot of the truly wealthy, you know, the multi -billionaires talk a lot about their children and how they're raising their children.

Chris (28:00.067)

Yes.

Jeremy (28:11.348)

But if you look at some of them, the ones that are able to, like I'm thinking of Grant Cardone, he's very public about how he's raising his kids and what they get, what they have access to, what they have to do for it. Shaquille O 'Neal, the same thing. He talks about, you know, yeah, I have a lot of money, but you don't have a lot of money and I'm going to make sure that I'm not just going to give you this money because that's the worst thing I can do for you as a parent.

Chris (28:38.893)

Right, right. Yeah, I think it is. And in one scenario, it's done out, you know, let's hope it's done out of a desire to want to retain somebody so that you can have the impact that you hope to have on them one day. Or in the other situation with a parent, it's done for the right reasons, i .e. I love my child.

I want to give them what I never had the opportunity to have. logical, totally logical.

Jeremy (29:10.597)

which is a logical desire, right? We all want our kids to have better lives than we

Chris (29:17.429)

Yep, yep, yep, but we have to temper that. We really do. And it's not easy, it's a balance and act for sure, but being mindful and aware of those things, I think in either case, when you give somebody something that they don't deserve, you

I think, and I'll use a strong word, but I think over time, I would certainly say the words appropriate, you cripple them. And I really, feel very strongly about that being done consistently over time. You cripple them. It creates a level of entitlement and it diminishes their want and their desire.

to create habits for themselves. And that's a scary road to go down on. Now, I'm gonna preface this with something else that almost sounds contradictory. This past week, we had a tournament, an inter -school tournament with our four schools. We brought them together and it was a sparring tournament. Now,

Here's where I do something that people would say, ha ha, you're not practicing what you're preaching. Every single student that competed in that tournament, whether they lost their first match or they took first place, they received a medal. They received an acknowledgement. Now,

there's a very strong stance out there that, you know, we're raising kids, everybody gets a trophy, everybody's a winner. I think it comes down to the motive and I think it comes down to the explanation given for why the result is given. When a child is six years old, nine years old, when a student is 43 years old and they've never competed in their life,

Chris (31:31.979)

and they've been really working hard and they muster up the courage to say, know what, I'm nervous about it, but I'll go in and I'm going to, I want to try it. I'm going to, I'm going to compete. I think that that medal to that person is an acknowledgement like good for you. You know what? You stepped up, you put yourself out there and you did it. Now,

What did you do right? What did you do wrong? Let's go back to the lab and let's work on it. So the idea of everyone getting a medal is the acknowledgement of that. It's not done out of any way, or form. Like I wanna hide the fact that somebody is incompetent, but I wanna keep that incompetence as a secret. No, no, no, no, it has nothing.

It's 800 miles away from that.

Jeremy (32:34.526)

I'm hearing it's a completely different culture. I imagine if I observe that event, right, because what you're talking about, what I think some schools, some events will do is they'll award first through fourth and then fifth and so on receive something so they don't cry. That's not what I'm hearing from you. I'm hearing that the priority is not on winning first place. The priority is on maybe participation or maybe

Chris (32:37.589)

it's okay. Yeah.

Jeremy (33:04.594)

education, learning, et cetera, and the winning, so to speak, is a secondary consequence.

Chris (33:14.959)

Absolutely. And by the way, my friend, let me, it's serendipitous that this thought just popped into my head, but you said crying. In 1991, again, I opened my school in July and I was working at a women's online clothing store. Before there was online, it was like a catalog. Yes.

Jeremy (33:39.872)

In 1991? Okay. Wow.

Chris (33:43.214)

Right. Cause I opened my school with $700 in the bank and my rent was $900. yeah, I'd say it was called Chadwick's of Boston. I don't know if it's still around, but what they did is they sent out catalogs. I'm circling around to get to the point on this. I hope I don't lose it in the woman's clothing, but we would literally get, you know, I had to go through about a week's worth of training.

Jeremy (33:49.736)

Right, well I figured there was a job in there somewhere, I just didn't imagine it would be online women's clothing. Keep going.

Chris (34:12.207)

And literally we would get calls from women all over the world. And, you know, I'd like to buy, you know, this dress on page 23 and you'd set up shipping and it would go out. And so I was just like, I never made outbound calls. just sat there and I read on limited power, Tony Robbins until the phone rang. And then I would answer the phone with my headset on and voila. So anyways, in October,

I ended up getting fired from that job because I had asked my supervisor in July when I took the job, said in October, I'm going to London to compete for the world championships. So I'm going to be out of the country for a week off. And she said, no, appreciate the notice and you know, problem. Well, in the process of it, my supervisor ended up getting moved

relocated or left the company or whatever and the supervisor said, hey, Chris, good luck. But if you're leaving for a week, you're done. So I politely said, well, I think you can understand. But so I tell you all of that background story to tell you this. I competed at the world championships and I was down by two points with about five seconds to go.

Jeremy (35:40.072)

to five.

Chris (35:41.903)

No, this was a two round match. -huh. So I was down by two points and The only thing that I could do to win it would be I would have to jump kick to the head and So I ended up, know taking a Hail Mary and jumping up in hitting this person with

flying axe kick, like a jump axe kick. And when I did it, he turned away and, you know, kind of took cover from it. Instead of awarding me the point, they gave him a warning and time expired. So if you look at me, uptaking second place in the world, you'll see me biting my lip.

because I can assure you they were tears. That was probably, you know, up until that point, certainly as a competitor, that was the saddest moment of my life, winning the silver medal. So does it really, my point in all of that is, it really matter if the person is crying because it's second place or the person is crying because they were a finalist?

Jeremy (36:54.366)

because you were so close.

Chris (37:09.451)

Here's the thing, I had a lesson. I had a lesson I had to learn. I, you know what, I never should have let it get that close. That one's on me. I, you know, I could, I could have left the sport and said, you know what, the judges are unfair or they just wanted this person to win or, you know, I could have done all of the justifications in the world. The reality is I had a lesson to learn. So now take it back to

in our school event. You know, everyone is getting a medal and they understand why they're getting a medal and it's explained to them. And then the instructors are following up with them this week and, you know, talking about it and what did you do and what did you think you did well and all of that. you know, how somebody feels and the fact that they're at tears.

Let me tell you something, and as you well know as being a martial artist, some of the greatest learning lessons we have in martial arts comes out of failure. So failure is not a bad thing. Failure is, the word failure I think is just an extreme level of feedback. It's an extreme level of emotional feedback that we feel. So it's not something,

we need to be afraid of. would rather a seven -year -old cry because he took second or he was a finalist than him not have that experience and then him be 37 years old and not know how to handle, you know, getting laid off or missing a promotion or something like that. That, to me, that's the crippling part of it. So allow these experiences.

it allowed them to come. It's wonderful. It's wonderful.

Jeremy (39:10.052)

Human beings learn by making mistakes, right? And one of the things that I'll talk about sometimes when I'm giving a seminar because most of the work that I do is around how people learn martial arts, right? And just I believe there's a lot of instinct that we ignore and you know, so we tend to do a lot of slower movement and one of the Kind of metaphors that I'll bring in is is a baby learning how to walk How does that baby learn how to walk by falling down a

I've never heard anyone say, you're a stupid baby, you should give up walking. We know inherently that this is how we learn things. And I love the way that you put it. You should have never let it get that close. You took the ownership on yourself. How can I improve the situation for next time? Now, I used to compete, I had plenty of those situations and I'm really thankful

Chris (40:04.515)

you

Jeremy (40:04.542)

You know, because I was competing in the mid 90s as a hyper traditional forms practitioner and competing in a circuit that seemed to reward more dynamic action. And my mother, you know, my mother was my coach and we had plenty of conversation about it. And she said, look, you just need to be so much better that there's no

Chris (40:18.494)

Of course.

Jeremy (40:32.99)

And that's what I did. And so we went back to, you know, I'm going to use your metaphor because I like it of the lab. We went back to the lab. How do I make this better? As I got to know judges, how can I make this better? How can I make this better? Do you remember the last time I did it? You told me to do this thing. Did I do that thing? And just pulling everybody in and figuring out how to do that. And that is the approach I've brought to to everything for the rest of my life.

Chris (40:33.219)

Yeah. Right.

Chris (40:47.363)

Right.

Jeremy (41:01.652)

You know, when people point to the successes that we've had here as an organization, it's not because I'm good at any of the things that we do, it's because I just didn't stop doing

Chris (41:13.889)

Right, right. Isn't it funny that you and I and the people that we admire, we're where we are, and they're where they are, you know, above us, because they've allowed themselves to fail more than we've currently failed. And, you know, when you turn that on its head and you, you fully embrace the truth of

Then it puts a totally different spin on what's our responsibility today because, and I'll be honest, you know, listen. Listen to what I say, don't watch me too close, you know, that type of thing. Do I, you know, come to the end of the day sometimes and I'm like, I just, I, you know, couldn't get out of my own way or I wanted to finish that project and I could, and

I'm experiencing the failure. And sometimes I define my day by did I complete it or did I not complete it? there's a very, yeah, there's a very, there's a very, yes, yes, yes, the but, the but is a big thing. I don't know if I told you the last time we spoke, but you know, for what it's worth, I share

Jeremy (42:23.584)

Sure, sure, I do that too. I think we all have that.

Chris (42:40.077)

because it's been such a profound lesson in my life. One of my teachers and the person that I would probably give the most credit to from a competitive standpoint that I got to mentor under was Billy Blanks, the gentleman that's more famous now for Taibo. But in his day, he was, you know, just, you know, top in the world and in sport karate. And we were at the school.

Jeremy (43:03.488)

dominant.

Chris (43:10.051)

One time and myself and a couple others We were in the back room and we were talking about You know that our experience this past weekend with a tournament that we went to and we were talking about how the judges were against us and the crowd was doing this and this person was biased and that you know, blah blah blah blah, know, we were just venting and he overheard us and he said he came over to us

And Billy is quite an imposing figure and I was 15 or 16 at the time. And he said to all of us, he said, you have to be so good that they can't take it from you. And until you're that good, just shut up and train. And I don't even know if he was that eloquent, but the message was received. And I cannot.

tell you. Thank God he came in and interrupted. He sent an electrical volt unlike anything that I had ever felt through my nervous system. And whether since that day or in addition to the lessons that I received from my mom and other people in my life that have been great influences on me, whenever

I feel like I'm making an excuse. It's like, I feel that electrical volt of shut up. You know, I'm using the word shut up to just kind of interrupt my mental thought. Like shut up until you're that good. You need to work your craft. You're obviously not good enough and that's okay. And by the way, that's okay. That's okay. You're where you're at.

And that's where you're at. It's not good or bad. It's just where you're at.

Jeremy (45:13.968)

One of the things, know, we've talked today and even pointed at it a short time ago, this idea that martial arts is never done, right? There's always more, there's always better, you're never perfect. And I think we have to be really careful, and this is something I'm spending a lot of time on right now, that if you set yourself up in a format where the desire is to continue to improve,

Chris (45:23.919)

Sure. Right.

Jeremy (45:38.048)

You have to find a way to celebrate successes along the way, be proud of yourself, to be happy. Because if you hinge happiness on perfection, and perfection does not exist, you leave yourself trapped. that's something that, you know, here I am, I'm 45 and I'm able to articulate that now. I'm not living it yet, but I see it. I see what needs to change in my life and I know

Chris (45:52.451)

Right.

Chris (46:01.347)

Yeah.

Jeremy (46:06.846)

I bring that up because I know I'm not the only one and I hear maybe a bit of that but with more experience and more self, more grace that you're giving yourself. And I want the audience to understand that, that yeah, chase the rainbows but you've got to take moments and be proud and be thankful and grateful and happy.

Chris (46:31.175)

Right, and let me say you look damn good for 45. And also too, as far as perfection. It's not worth chasing, I don't think, because it's just so unattainable. Simone Biles, yesterday.

Jeremy (46:35.156)

No, thank you. Thank you. I'm trying. I'm trying.

Chris (46:58.275)

You know, she's, they have named now two moves in her honor because nobody on the planet Earth has ever done them before. Yesterday, she did the second move in a more difficult fashion. So now she is the, okay, it's like

Jeremy (47:18.314)

I'm laughing because I watched it and it's

I don't even know how to describe how ridiculously good she is. People argue about in basketball, Michael Jordan or Kobe or LeBron, there's no argument in women's gymnastics.

Chris (47:33.671)

Right, It's crazy. It's insane. But, you know, even with somebody that is so far above every other human being on earth, she's still perfecting her art. So if Simone Biles cannot hit perfection because she continues to one up her perfection,

What the heck are we doing? You know, now, now that being said, what I, what I would offer is a suggestion that I'm sharing to remind myself and, also listeners, if this resonates with them, sometimes, you know, we say, well, you know, I'm training.

And, you know, how long have you been training? I've been, you know, training for, you know, put the number of years on it. It doesn't really matter. I do find at least with myself, I want to set a tangible goal that I'm going after. Perfection is not going to be it. So for example, for this year, I've devoted 2024 in addition to the things that I'm doing as

actually working on the symmetry of my physique and I'm working on my weight and I'm working on my body composition. Now all of these things have measurements associated with it and I've sought out a coach that is a professional in this area and why am I doing that? Because what I want to do is I want to be able

be chasing after something. When I set those goals, it creates intention in my work. At least for myself, I'm not good at just going to classes and logging attendance, you know, in my jujitsu or my Muay Thai or something like that, because without the intentionality around a goal, I'll kind of slide along laterally.

Chris (49:54.851)

I'll bring a half level, a three quarter level, whatever, of focus to that class. you know, one could argue from the outside, am I getting better or am I kind of plateauing? Now, the goal does not have to be competition. The goal might be, you know, the execution of a movement. The goal might be,

You know, I want to feel more comfortable when somebody has me in this position. I want to feel more comfortable escaping that because when anybody gets, when anybody making up, when somebody takes my back, I just feel so vulnerable, like I don't know what to do. Or when somebody throws a switch kick at me, a lot of times, you know, I'm, you know, not responding correctly. Create a tangible goal.

and continue to work on that goal until you achieve it and then set the next tangible goal. So some of them can be against a technique, it can be against a position. And then there are other goals that can take a little bit longer like the physique goal that I'm working on for 2024. But when a martial artist,

adds a level of tangibility. I think it just improves the level of intentionality that they bring to their practice and they bring to their week. You know, the one thing that competition always did for me, it kept me walking the straight and the narrow because if I was ducking my workouts, that's fine. You know, maybe my instructor didn't know. Maybe my classmates didn't notice, but I would get beat up on the weekends.

and I could only point the finger at myself. So I like to, so my equation of that not competing anymore is I like to create, I like to force my hand of self -discipline in that for me is setting the tangible goals.

Jeremy (52:16.32)

I'm big on goal setting, you know And I suspect that you you have a hard time in current as I do Getting people to see the value and goals because they're so afraid of not meeting them Right one of the things and and I'm not gonna call them out by name But I am gonna call out my team because not all of them would take Take my my push when I tell them like let's set let's set a goal We all you know all the divisions whistle -kick have goals for 2024. There are certain things that you

Chris (52:18.831)

Yeah.

Chris (52:28.269)

Right, right.

Jeremy (52:44.608)

that they have put down on paper and getting all any of them to set those goals early in the year was really tough. And I could see it in their eyes. Some of them even said it, but what if I don't? You can't look at it that way. Right. And, and, know, I'll be the first one to tell you what my goal last year was. It was that whistle kick was going to be profitable. And when I set that in January, 2023, I had no idea how we were going to get

Chris (52:58.445)

Yeah. Right.

Jeremy (53:11.806)

because it had been nine years of us not getting there. Well, we did it. And it wasn't until halfway through the year that I figured out what the thing was it was going to get us there. And we've got bigger goals for this year and we'll continue to have bigger goals because just as you're talking about, you've got to have that reason. And I think the longer that we train, the longer that our life looks, least from the outside, very similar day after day, week, month, year after year, the more you need those goals to shake things up

Chris (53:11.821)

Right.

Chris (53:15.651)

Yeah, yes, nice.

Chris (53:22.681)

Right.

Jeremy (53:41.652)

get you uncomfortable because growth doesn't come from comfort. Growth comes from

Chris (53:47.501)

Yes, without question, without question. Well said, my friend. And I think you brought up a point that there is a floppy muscle that a lot of us have when it comes to setting goals. Anything that we want to do, I kind of liken it to a muscle. You've got a self -discipline muscle. You've got a self -control muscle. You've got a confidence muscle.

And I think the knee -jerk reaction is, what if I miss it? If I don't set the goal, well, nobody can really hold me accountable. it creates a scenario where I'm assured that I won't feel the pain. The challenge is you're not going to grow as a result of that. So for my friends

In full disclosure, there are things that I'm really good at setting goals about and then there are things that I'm like a white belt at setting goals about. So when I feel that white belt insecurity come over me as it pertains to goal setting, I'm going to take that goal that I'm afraid to set or I'm setting it, but I'm like, I don't even believe it. And I'm going to take it from a year down to six months down to a quarter.

down to a month, down to two weeks, down to a week. And if I have to bring it all the way down to, okay, listen, I can spend a half hour twice a week on this goal, then all I'm gonna do is hold myself accountable for investing 60 minutes a week, because I can believe that.

So I think kind of like the progressive resistance when we're teaching martial arts is I think about goal setting. That's my version of I have to be able to meet myself where I'm at as it pertains to this goal. In the lowest place I can go will be can I get myself to invest and commit to this amount of time? And then if I can do that and I can develop that habit,

Chris (56:06.571)

Okay, I got that habit and I'm gaining proficiency because you can't help it if you bring in some intentionality to that half hour. Okay, what's the next thing that I can do and, you know, kind of take it from there? Yeah, something we're all working

Jeremy (56:22.692)

It sounds

I was going to use a visual to pose this next thing, I'm hearing in your words, I suspect that you continue to respect a gentleman that you've already mentioned. the quote that came to mind from him is when I think that I can't, I must. Right. And that's a Tony Robbins quote. And it's something that I embrace wholeheartedly. That's my trigger.

Chris (56:44.349)

Yes.

Jeremy (56:53.8)

When I feel that, that, okay, I've got to find a way to do this because that there's that appropriate level of discomfort. Not I'm terrified, not I'm going to die. But when I realize this action makes me super nervous, right? Which is what, hey, school owners, just about every single white belt that steps over your threshold feels

Chris (56:53.899)

Yeah.

Chris (56:57.487)

Yes.

Chris (57:11.481)

Yes.

Jeremy (57:17.936)

and beyond day one, right? So if you're not doing things that make you feel uncomfortable, it can be really difficult to relate to them and remember what it feels like, right? But setting those goals and breaking those things down, it's what we do in our training, it's what we do in martial arts curriculum. You keep showing up, you keep putting in the time and the energy, you keep looking for those incremental progresses, celebrating the wins, and eventually you look back and go, I'm kinda good at this.

Chris (57:40.845)

Yes.

Chris (57:46.144)

Right, right. And somebody pays you a compliment and you're like, what? Because they haven't been there on the journey and it's to you because you've been in it. It's not even a big deal because you're forgetting what you felt like in the beginning, right? We have a little acronym, SAS, day of students. And my staff knows that.

I just believe it at my heart and soul. Another reason why I still love martial arts as much as I do is because I am a student. I take lessons every single week. And I think my head would explode if I didn't because, yes please.

Jeremy (58:28.824)

Let me ask you a question because you you like I you are connected to and we haven't really gotten here But you know, there are some folks out there who don't know the the associations you've had to some I mean truly the best of the best of the best martial artists globally How many of them do you know that aren't finding? New things to undertake how many of the best martial artists do you know that aren't I'm gonna go cross -train in

Chris (59:00.555)

to the people that I admire zero. Yeah.

Jeremy (59:05.822)

There aren't a whole heck of a lot. you know, one of the people that I'm so fortunate enough to know and get to train with on occasion is Bill Wallace. you know, I've watched that man try new things and continually challenge himself. you know, most people would put him, you know, up, right? I'm not going to score it in any way. But when I think about these other people.

Chris (59:16.143)

Yep.

Chris (59:23.047)

Yep.

Jeremy (59:34.248)

The people that I look up to, the people that I see making the most impact, whether in or out of competition, in business, they're all continuing to learn and they're all willing to accept that, there are things here I don't know, there are things I'm not good at. Well, let me go get better at those.

Chris (59:49.359)

Right. Yeah. Well, Bill Wallace just received a lifetime achievement award, the first ever from from team Paul Mitchell. Yeah. And we he is the first ever in our 37 year history where we made him an honorary lifetime team member. We've never done that in 37 years.

Jeremy (01:00:01.172)

You had the chance to be involved in that, I saw, yeah.

Chris (01:00:19.091)

and who got it? Bill Wallace, because are you kidding me? I mean, if there is anybody that, you know, deserves that level of accolade, my goodness. I, you know, so many of us, him and the people that came before us so much, you know, cause we wouldn't be doing what we're doing if it

for him. And you know, when you, you know, he'll laugh it off and he'll joke it off and you know, he's a very humble and sometimes self -deprecating, but you know, I hope in his heart at night, he and so many others, I hope they allow themselves to feel the impact and the love and the support and the appreciation we all have for him, you know.

It was pretty special individual.

Jeremy (01:01:18.452)

I hope so

Jeremy (01:01:21.92)

Absolutely.

So this might be a good time for us to start to close. I normally don't call that much attention to it, but the reason I'm doing it now is because I think we have to have you back. think we need to, and we'll find a way to do this. We'll make Roman schedules and such, not as a part two about.

Chris (01:01:43.407)

Well, I know August 20th at 11 is available.

Jeremy (01:01:50.988)

Maybe, know, honestly, Andrew will hear this far before there. But I want to talk about, at some point, your involvement in competitive martial arts because of your involvement with Team Palma Jolla. just because I think there are lessons in there that everyone would benefit from hearing.

Even if even if competition isn't where they want to go anytime I get to talk to somebody who is tied in with the best in the world There are things that we can learn, right? So

Chris (01:02:30.807)

Yeah, I enjoy and I admire anybody that has devoted their life to a particular craft. I've said, know, in the analogy, I'm not a fan of ballet per se, but if I went to ballet, I would be swept away because I understand what those people did.

and how much they had to work their craft to be able to do what they do. And if I had the opportunity to listen to a lecture from somebody who was a master in ballet, I'd be in the front row seat, you know, taking notes because there's the commonalities that I know I would benefit from. So, yeah, I don't look at it as a competitive, you know, or, well,

I don't do that art or something like that. I think there's plenty of commonalities that we can all glean from.

Jeremy (01:03:35.08)

agree. If I was watching ballet, I'm probably gonna be looking at it as as kicks and saying, all right, well, you know, that's all right. I think I'll bring that combo back to class. Students might enjoy that. That could be fun. Chris, if people want to get a hold of you, you know, your school, your personal stuff, where would they go?

Chris (01:03:46.417)

Yeah.

Chris (01:03:56.803)

There's an actual website, chrisrappold .com, that you know somebody can find some information about me. The name of our school is Personal Best Karate, so I'm sure if they Google that they could find that. either one of those would be great. Certainly Facebook, you know, on there. Yeah, in places.

Jeremy (01:04:17.702)

Yeah, you're all over. I see you all over. You're in places. To the audience, please, you know, go check out those things and I hope that you really take some of these lessons that we've talked about here today around goals and growth and discomfort to heart and take a look at your own lives and see where maybe are you not challenging yourself. You probably don't have the capacity to challenge every aspect of your life at the same time.

but you probably have the capacity to challenge yourself a little bit more than you are. And so don't be afraid to embrace that because what you want from life will require that. see the cause and effect there. And of course, make sure you check out the show notes, all the stuff that Chris and I have talked about today. But now Chris, I'm gonna throw it to you. do we close? How do we wrap this episode? What do you wanna tell

Chris (01:04:54.998)

Mm -hmm.

Chris (01:05:05.423)

I just, you know, having the opportunity to do a second podcast with you today, I just, I want to thank you for everything that you're doing for the martial art industry. I think having conversations like this elevates the awareness of the value and the benefits of what martial arts can do for people. I also think

you know, talking to people like, you know, we did together, like people like Buzz Dirk and then Dave Kovar, you know, Jeremy, you're really doing us a service because you're preserving martial art history because like we were there, Bruce Lee and Chuck Norris and, and those, those people, know, 20 years from now, 30 years from now, there's going to be the stories of these people that you're talking to. So you're creating

you're creating a platform for in -depth conversation with people that we can all learn from. So the way that I would like to close, is to give a nod to you and say thank