Episode 996- Mr. Noah Dever
In this episode, Andrew sits down and chats with Noah Dever and discuss his journey of being a PE teacher, his family, and his martial arts training.
Mr. Noah Dever - Episode 996
SUMMARY
In this episode of Whistlekick Martial Arts Radio, Andrew interviews Noah Dever, who shares his journey into martial arts, influenced by his family and personal experiences. Noah discusses his early start in martial arts, the impact of his family's involvement, and his transition from student to teacher. He reflects on the challenges and joys of teaching physical education, drawing from his own experiences as a student. The conversation highlights the importance of mentorship, emotional growth, and the unique dynamics of training within a family. In this conversation, Noah Dever discusses the integration of martial arts and education, emphasizing the importance of teaching life skills and creating inclusive programs for students of all abilities. He reflects on his experiences as a PE teacher and martial arts instructor, highlighting the impact of mentorship on his teaching philosophy. Noah shares his aspirations for the future, including the desire to own a dojo and pursue a PhD in education, while advocating for the accessibility of martial arts for everyone.
TAKEAWAYS
His father’s positive experience in martial arts encouraged Noah's training.
Noah's family, including siblings, all became involved in martial arts.
Training with siblings can be both fun and challenging.
Noah's mother, a physical therapist, provided valuable insights for teaching.
He transitioned from being a student to a teacher at a young age.
Noah emphasizes the importance of understanding students' emotions.
Teaching physical education allows Noah to connect with students on a personal level.
Noah's journey reflects the significance of mentorship in martial arts.
Teaching martial arts is about imparting life skills.
Discipline is about doing what needs to be done, even when you don't want to.
Creating routines helps students feel safe and comfortable.
Adaptive programs are essential for inclusivity in martial arts.
Mentorship plays a crucial role in shaping teaching styles.
Games in PE and martial arts help navigate social interactions.
It's important to hold firm boundaries while being empathetic.
Teaching is about providing a community for students.
Everyone deserves the opportunity to earn a black belt.
Future goals include owning a dojo and educating future teachers.
CHAPTERS
00:00 Introduction and Podcast Overview
02:10 Noah's Early Martial Arts Journey
05:00 Family Influence in Martial Arts
08:01 Training with Siblings and Parents
11:08 Utilizing Family Expertise in Teaching
13:55 Transitioning from Student to Teacher
16:58 Becoming a PE Teacher and Teaching Philosophy
20:03 Reflections on PE and Student Experiences
27:07 The Intersection of Martial Arts and Education
36:31 Creating Inclusive Programs for All
44:51 Mentorship and Its Impact on Teaching
49:47 Future Aspirations in Martial Arts and Education
After listening to the episode, it would be exciting for us to know your thoughts about it.
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Show Transcript
Andrew (02:12.12)
Hello, welcome. You're listening or watching to the next episode of Whistlekick martial arts radio. And today I'm joined by Noah Devere. Noah, how are you today? I'm doing great. Thank you. Great. Great to have you here. before we get going, I just wanted to make sure to let everybody know about all of the things that Whistlekick does because this podcast is but one small piece in the large Whistlekick cog. And if you go to Whistlekick.com, you can find out all of the things that we do.
Noah Dever (02:20.827)
Good, how are you?
Andrew (02:41.598)
and get involved with some of our in-person events, whether it's Marshall Summit in New England, whether it's our multiple free training days throughout the country, or all in weekend, or maybe you want to buy some merchandise, which if you use the code podcast15, you'll save yourself 15%. But maybe you want to buy a book, maybe you want to buy a training program, maybe you want to get faster or stronger or more flexible. All of that stuff can be found at whistlekick.com.
If you are interested in this show specifically, you can go to whistlekickmartialarchradio.com and find out all the episodes that we've done. We've done so many episodes that I guarantee you, will find one that you will enjoy of a guest you probably know. So head on over there and check out all of this that we do. But today, Noah, we're here to talk about you. So life is going good today?
Noah Dever (03:38.107)
Yeah, life is good. Just hangin'.
Andrew (03:40.384)
Awesome. So we have a bit of a knowledge of each other. We've gotten together. We've trained together. And I thought this would be fun to sit down with you and talk about your journey and figure out how you got involved in martial arts in the first place.
Noah Dever (03:57.987)
Yeah, no, it's fun. This is my first time being here. how I got started. So I'm currently 26. I started when I was, I can't remember if it was five and a half or six, somewhere in there. Basically, my dad grew up doing martial arts for a while when he grew up in Boston.
Andrew (04:17.71)
Yeah.
Noah Dever (04:24.843)
My mom has no experience in the martial arts and I, as a kindergarten kid, was obsessed with Power Rangers growing up. So I looked at my mom and I said, I'm going to do that. And she said, no, absolutely not. Because one of the things with me growing up and one of the things my mom was worried about is I...
run pretty high on the anxiety scale and that as a child not knowing how to like talk about those things it manifested as a lot of anger and so my mom was like I'm going to put this five and a half six year old in martial arts teach him how to punch and kick
not know what to do with his emotions and this is going to be an absolute disaster and My dad was the one who went no No, like this was actually really good for me as a kid It like gave me the discipline and the things that I needed for my life. And so they brought me I'm from Exeter so People at home probably know Craig Wehram and John English also did an episode
They brought me to Karate International in Exeter. We were in an old industrial warehouse at the time. And Mr. English took me under his wing. And I've been here ever since. Basically. Yeah.
Andrew (05:51.062)
Now, how much of your father's influence do you think was there in your also, I mean, I know you mentioned Power Rangers, but if your dad trained as well, was there any sort of connection there too?
Noah Dever (06:00.027)
Yeah.
Noah Dever (06:04.359)
So not at first. My dad wasn't in martial arts, but so I'm the oldest of five. So there are seven people in my family. And the cool thing is once I got in, everybody got in. We always joked with John and Craig growing up that my family was putting up rent for a hot second because all four of my siblings took karate with me.
Then on top of that my parents got into it. My mom has a blue belt in karate and a Green a yellow or a green belt in Yoshitsune combat jujitsu and my dad was a brown belt in both So it was one of those things where I still poke fun at them and I'm like so when am I getting another? Dever black belt up in here. Like when are you coming to my class winner and those kind of things so
Not really at first, but my dad is also a police officer or a federal agent. So my dad and I talk a whole lot about different martial arts aspects because he gets a completely different viewpoint into martial arts than I have ever experienced because he's had to actually use martial arts and whatnot. So it's kind of interesting.
Andrew (07:24.128)
And what was it like having your siblings training with you? I know instances where it's gone either way. Can you talk a little bit about training with your with your siblings?
Noah Dever (07:36.919)
So it's been hit or miss. My sister, so far right now there's only two of us that have gotten our adult black belt. At our school there's, I think the philosophy is that in order to get your adult black belt you need to be mentally, physically, and emotionally ready. And we just don't think teenagers and kids have that capability. So most of the time you have to be at least a senior in high school to test for your adult black belt.
So my brother Ian and I are the only ones to have our adult black belts. However, my sister got her third degree junior. it was fun for me because in my middle school, high school years, I transitioned from just a student and into teaching as well. So I had the pleasure and sometimes displeasure of teaching all of my siblings as well. So that could be.
a time and a half. My sister and I were really close at that time doing those things. I'm blessed, my family and I are all very close and the arts was just something that kind of helped us stay in contact and I still joke with my sister that she needs to come back and train with me. I will say, we always tell kids, no, no, no, you can show mom, dad at home or the parents at home, the figures at home, your martial arts, but we don't teach our siblings.
martial arts because if they, you don't have the experience, you don't have the black, you're not a black belt instructor. So that could get unsafe. And I know sometimes that's hit or miss with whether or not kids actually use their karate at home. For example, in a house full of seven people who all do martial arts, my siblings and I were constantly tooling on each other. And so I remember there was an instance where Craig and I were on the mat teaching and I was in high school.
My youngest brother, Jack, is in the class. And one of his classmates' parents had pulled Craig aside and was like, hey, they're using pretty hands-on with their sibling at home. Could you have a mat chat and figure that out? And Craig, trying to teach me how to be a better teacher, goes, hey, I'm gonna have you do this mat chat about how you grew up, you had all these siblings doing karate, and you never used your karate at home and all these things.
Noah Dever (09:58.567)
We were never unsafe with it, but like, we wrestled, we horse played and whatnot. This kid was taking it at another level. And so I looked at Craig and I went, yeah, absolutely. I will try and give this match out, but you got to pay off the snitch out back. Because Jack is going to just absolutely lose his mind laughing and completely undermine this. And Craig giggled and went over and went, hey, Jack, I know Noah and you goof off at home, but.
You need to he's trying something here. So play along and It was a good time
Andrew (10:35.122)
Yeah, that, mean, the sibling rivalry, for what it is, can be difficult when you're training. And did you have an instance of you having to train your parents? Because that's another very interesting dynamic. And do you have stories from that?
Noah Dever (10:40.252)
Yeah.
Noah Dever (10:51.481)
So I've never had to train my parents. I've been training partners with my parents. When we were in 2020, there was a Yoshitsune class that was starting and my mom loved Yoshitsune. She had an injury and it kind of made her really nervous to come back. She has five kids, so she was carting them all around the place. Always wanted to get back, but it made her nervous and whatnot. So during COVID, there was an opportunity.
where you had to have a bubble buddy and you could only have one partner and they had to be masked and we're doing this like combat jujitsu like wrist locks on each other and my mom was like you're my bubble buddy i'm coming back so we have videos of my mom just like hip tossing me onto the ground and like kicking me and like doing this stuff and so we we had a good time my mom and i have always really
loved it and she's a physical therapist. So she loves how manipulating how the body moves and whatnot has always been a fascination of hers. So being able to do that with her and kind of bring that back was really special and something that I enjoyed.
Andrew (12:07.534)
Now, so your mom was able to utilize her knowledge of, you know, the human body and how it works. Your dad working with law enforcement to some degree. So you have two different avenues of people that you can go to to talk about a lot of the things that some of us don't have. Have you been able to take advantage of that in a way that others can't? And can you elaborate on that?
Noah Dever (12:33.233)
Yeah. No, no, no. Absolutely. So like my mom, as a physical therapist, I'm a, so during the day, I'm an elementary school PE teacher. And then in the afternoon, I helped Craig and John run our two karate international locations. And so there have been multiple times where I've had a student whose body moves differently than yours or mine due to either a physical or mental disability, or we have
Just students who they do something and I'm like, what are you doing? I've never seen somebody do that before and My mom has been a resource for me. I'm like, okay like Why would their body move like this? Why is that something that's going on? What is something I can do to help them and like especially like adult students who I teach who have hip inflexibility or
problems with their back or their knees or their hips. My mom is normally my sounding board for those kinds of things. I'm like, what are things that I can do to help them to give them strength for this? Because that's her profession. And then my dad, a lot of times when we're getting into the self-defense with the reality martial arts and all of that, I look at my dad and I'm like, what are things that you look for when you are
Andrew (13:42.35)
Hmm.
Noah Dever (13:57.507)
approaching a situation. Like my dad has had multiple situations where he's had to approach and have a conversation with somebody who's presenting as hostile and with his martial arts background there was a guy holding a screwdriver with the tip down kind of like the jabbing motion and all of his buddies start backing up and start bringing their hands to their ways because that's a dangerous weapon and this guy's
hostile, my dad starts walking towards him to close the distance. And all of his buddies are giving him a hard time. And my dad's like, what are you doing? I'm going to try and control the screwdriver and like, if he's going to swing it. But he's also my dad's very, he's a charmer. He's, he's the kind of guy that will charm and disarm somebody and like talk through it if he needs to. And so I often look at him like, okay.
If I have somebody do this, is this self-defense or is this taking you a step too far? Are there illegal repercussions? What are things that I can be teaching my students that like, okay, I had the situation, I dealt with it. How do they need to state the facts to the police? Like, what are you looking to assess when you go to a scene and take notes and whatnot? So it's cool. get the physiology side from my mom.
And then my dad, get the real life kind of experience of self-defense and whatnot. So, and he's also, he worked for the U.S. Postal Inspection Service. which is the oldest federal law enforcement agency, as it'll tell you. It's a big deal for him, but he, he was a, the expert in the country in MP5 operatings. So my dad,
Andrew (15:36.59)
Mm-hmm.
Noah Dever (15:54.233)
on top of being a law enforcement guy is a world-class teacher and instructor and would get flown all across the country to teach people how to operate safely. So I also kind of get the teaching tips and the teaching knowledge from my dad as well.
Andrew (16:11.426)
Yeah. Now you're, you mentioned that your teacher in your day job, and, then in the afternoon, when you're done school, you go to the dojo and you teach as well. What was that transition like from being a student to starting to be a teacher?
Noah Dever (16:15.185)
Yep. Yep.
Noah Dever (16:29.383)
So for me, I started teaching or assisting in classes when I was 13, 12, 13. And I was just identified to be an assistant instructor, that guy that goes around tying belts, high-fiving kids, and just giving praise, building the atmosphere of the room. I thought, based off of my own being 13, 14, it's very self-centered.
selfish view of the world I Looked at John and Craig and all of these guys that taught me growing up these guys and girls it was They were the best of the best at the school to steal from you a little bit with best of the best and they They I wanted to be like them and so I just thought teaching was the next step and it was like okay if I want to be the best black belt possible if I want to be
Andrew (17:14.753)
you
Noah Dever (17:28.187)
the best that Karate International has to offer. I needed to teach and I was invited to do so and I kept going with it. What I found out was that I really thoroughly enjoyed it and because I grew up being the oldest of like five kids, like I kind of knew how to be an older brother and at that age, that's all I really had to be is I just needed to be an older brother and a mentor to these kids coming up and.
Eventually, Craig and John showed me how to do things and I was brought into their teacher program and the teacher program is kind of like what we had.
kind of what grew Jeremy and Craig going, we can do like Matic from this, of like Craig really formalized how he wanted to make teachers and Jeremy loved that idea and they kind of took it and went with it. To my knowledge, I could be totally off base, but yeah, yeah.
Andrew (18:24.366)
Mm hmm. That's what I understand as well. For those listening, MADEC is the martial art teacher training certification course that Whistlekick has put together, spearheaded by Craig Wareham and Jeremy.
Noah Dever (18:40.699)
Yeah, so I'm kind of like Generation Alpha when it comes to MADEC, I guess, because I was the guinea pig in that case. So went through it, got, and one of the cool things that we do at KI is we go into PE programs, local PE programs to teach kids about martial arts. And the way we do it is not to be like, to an extent, I want kids in my dojo, but we also understand that...
my teaching style and Craig's teaching style isn't gonna be for everybody. And so I always ended all of those seminars being like, hey, like, if you liked any of the stuff we did today, go and find martial arts. Because for me, PE was not my thing growing up. I was vastly unathletic and way too competitive for my own good. And martial arts was the thing that I actually took to. That was my sport.
Andrew (19:11.15)
Mm-hmm.
Noah Dever (19:36.273)
Football, baseball, loved them, could not play for the life of me. And as we go through, I'm like, you guys have a lot of awesome places around here. Just find one, try it out, see what happens. And through that, I was in college at the University of New Hampshire on the Durham campus and was in school to be an environmental lawyer when I left, which...
Andrew (19:40.526)
you
Noah Dever (20:05.745)
For those of you who know me, my attention span would not have worked at all for being a lawyer or a scientist in that manner. So I graduated 2020 with my degree in environmental conservation and I was doing these school things and my friend Katie McNamara, who teaches in Main Street School in Exeter, which is a K to two school, I asked her for teaching tips because Craig looked at me and goes, hey.
Katie's phenomenal at this, ask her some teaching tips. And he, and I asked her and she goes, honestly, you're doing everything that they teach you at like a collegiate level, like keep refining, gave me some pointed teaching tips. She went, why don't you go and be a PE teacher? I was like, oh, that'd be kind of cool. And then I graduated 2020 was looking at grad school, looking at trying to get a job in the environmental field.
But the dojo and running a dojo someday was my end goal. And I had a lunch conversation with John, and John went, dude, go be a teacher. Be a teacher during the day. Run a school in the evening, and then eventually phase from one end to the other. I was like, that'd be kind of cool. So I asked Katie if she could point me to some good PE programs. Got me a call with the head of the UNH guy, who was a
We call him Steve. Dr. Wright. Dr. Wright. I could totally be messing that up right now. I only had him for a year. But Steve was the man. And Dr. G over there was awesome too. But I had a phone call with Steve and he was like, you have a bachelor's from UNH. You'd be a non-traditional. We'd be working towards your masters. But yeah, this was in August. Classes started in two weeks and he was like.
Yeah, if you send over the paperwork, we'll get you started in like two weeks. Do you want to start in two weeks? And I went, yeah, I mean, full send it. Let's go. Let's try it. And so I started at UNH in the fall of 2020 in something completely different than I had my bachelor's, which also has been great for me teaching teen students, looking at them going, you don't need to know what you're going to do for the rest of your life at 18 years old.
Andrew (22:03.853)
Wow.
Noah Dever (22:29.743)
I thought I was going to be a lawyer. And now I teach kids handball and quidditch in to fifth graders. And so I started there and I give Jeremy Craig some credit. UNH's Phenomenal Program, they introduced me to like the teaching style of public school.
I already knew kind of how to teach. And so it was just using my teaching style and morphing it into what public education prefers and kind of like the rules of the road for that venue, which is different than private education. But you you had to know the rules of engagement for that area. we do peer teaching. like they gave me like, I'll never forget it with
Andrew (23:02.574)
Mm.
Noah Dever (23:23.175)
my we did a track and field unit and they teach you they say hey here's the thing go learn how to teach it you get 10 minutes you're going to teach it to your peers and then we're going to roll from there and so i picked the triple jump for track and field which is kind of obscure jumping sport but one of my buddies was a triple jumper at unh so i was like oh i can hit him up for some resources never did i just watched a bunch of youtube on it and
Andrew (23:42.444)
Mm-hmm.
Andrew (23:48.174)
Thank
Noah Dever (23:53.989)
They went, we all pulled up to the UNH track and he was like, all right, who wants to go first? And I was like, I want to get this over with, let me at it. I taught for 10 minutes. We all got back, sat down and Steve sat there and went, okay, well obviously Noah's taught before. So that's cool. Makes me a whole lot less worried about this now going forward. I didn't realize that Steve was like super worried about having to.
Andrew (24:15.319)
you
Noah Dever (24:22.587)
get me to be a teacher in two years, but he was like, I can just like, tell this kid like what to do now and he'll be fine. yeah, that's kind of, UNH was fun, I did a year there and then you basically interned for a year and I got to work with Katie, the woman who got me into it. So shout out to Katie McNamara, she's amazing. Who was a New Hampshire PE Teacher of the Year.
Andrew (24:44.608)
Mm-hmm.
Noah Dever (24:51.299)
And then in the fall, I was teaching with Mark Ruest and Ashlyn Radcliffe in Deerfield, and both of them are New Hampshire PE teachers of the year. like, I was really blessed because I like learned how to teach from really good people in the martial arts. And then I sought out and got to teach with excellent PE teachers. So, and just become a sponge and learn all of their tips and whatnot. So it's been fun.
Andrew (24:51.832)
Go back.
Andrew (25:21.024)
Yeah, so definitely fortuitous that you fell in with the right people. That it was it was what you were meant to do. And I find it interesting that you grew up not enjoying PE. And ended up, you know, teaching it. I'm curious if you could talk a little bit about what it was like as a student, but going into schools with your teachers, working with their PE programs and
Noah Dever (25:26.672)
Yeah, 100%.
Noah Dever (25:35.61)
yeah.
Andrew (25:50.712)
how that may have translated into your actually becoming a PE teacher as well. Does that have any bearing at all?
Noah Dever (25:57.767)
So it was cool. got to go, like you said, I got to go to all of my different schools that I went to growing up and teach there. And I wanna say this correctly. These people were not the reason why I wasn't good at PE or why I didn't enjoy PE. All of the reasons why I didn't like PE was me. And I think that's something that a lot of new teachers don't know.
is and have to learn pretty quickly is that it is not you. Like nine times out of ten if a kid is having a bad day that's just that. Like it's not anything to do with you. You can't take it personal and just move on and do your best for them in that given moment. And I was just a highly emotional competitive kid.
who did not know how to express his emotions. so, PE was not a good place for me because I was super unathletic, not coordinated, but was a perfectionist with high anxiety who wanted to be the best. And I couldn't. And so, at that point in time, because my mentality was so wrong about everything at that point in my life. And so, going back and teaching with these people, I was like,
They're human beings and they're really cool and I really enjoy them. so getting that kind of like different view on things was really nice. And also getting to.
What's word with it?
Noah Dever (27:40.645)
getting to look at all of these kids and be like, hey, listen, I've been in your shoes and this is what I'm doing now. It's always kind of fun too. Like I was here when, and they're all like, whoa, you're really old. I had a kid look at me the other day and was like, yeah, they were like in the 19s. I was like, let's simmer down. The 19s were not that long ago. And so, but it's all good.
Andrew (27:46.328)
Hmm.
Andrew (28:04.034)
You
Noah Dever (28:07.515)
But yeah, no, it's fun going back and seeing them and I will actually like go and visit them When it's karate week like I know Craig has an event or something that he has to go and I actually get to go I'm taking a personal thing going and teaching karate at Main Street So I get to go and hang out with Katie again and like do all those things, which will be fun
Andrew (28:30.894)
Mm-hmm.
Andrew (28:36.502)
Now you're teaching PE during the school day, during the day, and then you're at the school at night, the dojo at night. What, what similarities do you see between both? Like do you, how much of your martial arts do you use in your PE teaching and how much have you learned from being a PE teacher that you have been able to take into the dojo?
Noah Dever (29:03.111)
So it's it's funny like when it when it comes to like teaching It I Teach like a karate teacher at the doge at public school like I I've always had a firm belief that what we teach is not It is the skills like like I'm teaching punches kicks grappling all of that
But at the end of the day, What a martial arts program to me is life skills. You're teaching kids how to be a good person and teaching them goal setting, discipline, those kind of things. And discipline, feel like is one of those words that is like, like you discipline the kid. I'm like, no, no, no, no. I'm teaching them how to, when motivation is not there, still do the things that they need to do, even though they don't want to do it. that's a life skill that most adults are still working on.
myself included. And so I guess that philosophy has come into the gym, where I've even looked at fifth graders when they're having a tough day in the class. I'm like, listen, going to middle school next year, I do not care if you know how to kick a ball. Like, some of you are going to be excellent at it. I'm fully aware that some of you are not. I need you to be able to be a good person, to work well with each other.
because I can teach you how to kick a ball when you're 80. I can teach you how to kick a ball when you're 20 or you're 15. If you are able to be a good learner and a good person that works well with other people, you are going to take that with you for the rest of your life. And that's always the philosophy I've taken into my classes in the gym. Vice versa, going from the gym to the dojo, routines I found are extremely important.
I was a little bit more freeform as a teacher at the dojo whereas I know especially kids coming from a Trauma background or a student that falls on the autism spectrum These students love a consistent routine. Of course, I'm going to push it because life is never going to be routine organized all the time
Noah Dever (31:27.345)
there are going to be times I'm going to throw a wrench in the things and teach you how to get through it. But if I can set up a routine in a way where these students are finding success, getting into the door and then feeling safe and comfortable, that's something I can do. And with that too, like teaching in P.E., I've learned about how to read IEPs or individualized education plans. And some of the philosophies
behind some of like the education law of IDEA, which is the Individuals with Disabilities in Education Act. Everybody has to have PE, regardless of ability, in a public school. And with that being said, it needs to be in the least restrictive environment. And for that, it depends on who you are.
Andrew (32:22.606)
Hmm.
Noah Dever (32:27.353)
So like there are kids where I can throw into a general PE class, they're gonna thrive. There are some kids that are not. And so with that, I've had to make different choices for my class. So my school before I got there, there wasn't an adapted physical education class. There is one now where I basically for all of my students who qualify, I give them a preview of what we're doing this week.
and help pre-teach them some of the skills before they go into the actual class. And because of that, and there are also kids that like, will teach one-on-one before they get to my class and be like, okay, here's what's gonna happen. If we feel ourselves getting frustrated, what is a choice or an option that we can take? And they're like,
I can like go sit in your office door and look at the Dungeons and Dragons books until I'm ready. And I'm like, perfect, do that. And then come back to me and we'll get you back in. Some days they're going to be able to get back in, some days they're not. And that's okay. It's, it's, it's a marathon. It's not a sprint, but at the dojo, what's that's turned into is I now have an adaptive martial arts class that I have for adult students that are young adult students that fall somewhere on the spectrum.
Andrew (33:37.198)
Mm-hmm.
Noah Dever (33:50.523)
And it's just me and them and maybe one or two other instructors. And it's a blast. It's my favorite class of the week. we get to, they get to have a safe space where they can do martial arts and work towards black belt because everybody should have the opportunity to earn a black belt. And right now my goal is we have the karate, karate international core curriculum.
And I'm adapting that. because this is the first time we're doing that, I'm like, no, no, no, no, this needs to be repeatable. Like I can't just do this. And then when I die or when I leave or when something goes like, this is something that needs to happen. So I, I need to start the roadmap. So that way, and then start teaching the next guy. In order for them to be able to do that. So that's something Craig and I are currently working on is.
making that curriculum, what it it look like for that student to get to their black belt and what's a way that I as their instructor can get them there. And then, yeah, sorry, brain. There's.
Andrew (35:04.622)
No, that's great. Tangents are what this channel is all about.
Noah Dever (35:10.223)
Yeah, yeah. And so like, for example, too, at the dojo, least restrictive environment, I have some students that start with me private lessons one on one. I've had a student that started with me in private lessons one on one for about two years, who now is in, he's like a purple blue belt and is in the general class.
and is being taught by 16, 17 year old teachers and he's doing great. And I'm talking to mom and not only is this kid doing this, they're also participating in cross country at their school. That's the thing with the least restrictive environment. That's a flexible term. They start off here. My end goal.
for some is to grow them into the general population class. Some that's not gonna happen and that's okay. But it's meeting students where they're at and making sure that, again, everybody deserves to do martial arts because it changed my life. I'm pretty sure from our conversations that it's probably changed yours too. like, I think it needs to be accessible to every-
Andrew (36:27.993)
Sure.
Noah Dever (36:34.723)
And so we're working, one of my goals is making sure that A, it is accessible to everybody and B, making sure that I have the next generation coming up that is confident with their tools in order to make that happen. And we'll see, it's going to be a lot of work, but it's important work, you know, so.
Andrew (37:01.91)
Yeah. Now, so you started teaching at the P.E. program and you created an adaptive P.E. program. were teaching at the karate school. You created this adaptive karate program. What do you think made it such an important part of your journey and of your giving back that you create these programs? Like, was it? Was there something that said, have to do this?
Noah Dever (37:31.367)
So, I will say this, the dojo in Exeter had a relationship with Easter Seals, New Hampshire. And so, actually my first time teaching adults with various mental, emotional, physical disabilities, or just their bodies move differently than yours or mine, was in Exeter. And Craig had been teaching this class, and he...
Andrew (37:40.558)
Mm-hmm.
Noah Dever (38:00.409)
It's a half an hour class. There's about 20 adults in there. And Craig looked at me and goes, all right, you're 20. Go give him a shot. And yeah, I'd watched him teach it twice. And he was like, do it. Just, just roll with it. And like with those classes, you just have to be flexible. so I, Craig had experience, had shown me kind of like the start. And I think the biggest barrier to people a lot of the time is understanding.
and people didn't just, like for me, I was nervous that I was gonna say the wrong thing or not be the right person for the job. And in reality, I just needed to be there and show that I cared. And I got in, showed that I cared, and it was a blast. And the reason why I personally think that this has been such a big thing for me is martial arts was my thing.
I was not an athlete, but I wanted to be one. I wanted to have these abilities. And in PE growing up, I felt like I wasn't being shown like these things. And I was, I just wasn't in a place to hear it at the time. And...
Noah Dever (39:27.943)
teaching those skills and teaching those opportunities to everybody and giving that education to everybody is important because when I was a kid, I felt like I wasn't, like I was excluded. Upon further reflection in years of therapy, I was not excluded. just, I was excluding myself because I was nervous. But I now make it an effort in those classes of finding those kids that
Andrew (39:49.582)
Sure.
Noah Dever (39:56.871)
feel like they don't belong and being like, no, no, no, no, no, you belong and you belong right here with all the rest of us. And it's going to be great. Sometimes it's going to be better than others, but that's all right. I, I, yeah, sorry. My, my, my, my train went off for a second.
Andrew (40:18.542)
That's quite all right. That's good. That's good. Now I also know that in your teaching early education P Yeah, and you know there tends to be a lot of I'm not I don't want to generalize but there tends to a lot of games right and and obviously we're talking organized games like basketball and soccer and like think volleyball things like that, but
Noah Dever (40:28.731)
Third, fourth, and fifth. Yep.
Noah Dever (40:36.229)
Yeah.
Andrew (40:46.926)
especially at the earlier age, there tends to also be just a lot of games. And in a lot of kids classes for martial arts, there tends to be not an entire class of games, but often there are some games. What correlations have you been able to take back and forth from those two roads?
Noah Dever (41:07.719)
So like for example like at the the dojo One of the big things in PE is we don't make Fitness a punishment. So like I don't want like my my fifth grade to be like like I have to push ups like push-ups are awful It's like no, no, we get to do push-ups push-ups make you stronger. Like that's awesome and So one of the things that I've taken from like
PE to martial arts is like, if you are not doing the expectations, if you're not following our behavior, you will not be invited to play in the game at the end of class. That's just the natural consequences. you can't follow our group expectations, that's just how it rolls. If you're choosing not to be a part of the group, you won't be able to participate in the fun part of class.
the quote unquote fun part. And then in school,
Part of that is just like holding those expectations, like at the dojo. I feel like we try and explain away some things occasionally, but holding those firm boundaries, especially for the kids, there are kids that I understand where you're coming from. I understand why your behavior is the way that it is. And I'll unpack that with them and their case managers and the guidance counselors. But at the same time, I'm like, I get it.
but we can't do that. You're gonna hurt somebody or you're gonna hurt yourself. And I remember even Dojo just unpacking it during a game with a kid. I was like, why are you sitting out? He's like, because I'm mad. I'm like, no, I don't care if you're mad. You can play angry all you want. You cannot make other people uncomfortable and you can't.
Noah Dever (43:10.247)
put yourself or others in danger. And he went, wait, I can be mad? I'm like, yeah, I play mad all the time. But I make sure that people know that they're gonna be safe with me and I'm gonna be safe to myself. And he looked at me and he went, okay. Wait, so I can like be mad but be in control of my body? I'm like, yes, everybody does that. Yeah, that's normal, that's fine.
Like being mad is not a bad thing. like with games and I know like games are a way to navigate social problems. Most of my teaching is not, I set up the game, I teach them the skills and I'll provide feedback to help with the skills but I find most of the feedback that I'm having to give is, well yeah, no, the advice you gave them was great.
the tone you used made them think that they were mad at you. So maybe use a different tone. They're like, what's tone? And so I stole it from my buddy Mark, one of my favorite Mark Ruest and Deerfield. He looked at a bunch of seventh and eighth graders and was like, do you guys know what tone is? And they're like, no. And he's like, Noah, come here. And he's like, Noah, I love you, man. You're the best ever. And he starts like yelling at me. I'm like, whoa. And they're like.
Did it sound like I was giving Mr. Devere like a bunch of love and compliments? And they're like, no, sounded like you were really mad at him. And he goes, so what I was saying did not matter because of how I was saying it. And they were like, he's like, that's tone. So we have that conversation annually in the gym. We have it at the dojo. games, PE, and martial arts is all life skills.
Andrew (44:56.782)
Mm-hmm.
Noah Dever (45:04.567)
It's teaching kids how to cooperate and be respectful and empathetic towards each other. And that truly is what I feel like I teach. And that's the philosophy John and Craig instilled in me and Mark and Katie showed me. And then at UNH, they just showed me that's for everybody. like, yeah, it's all about being a good person and
getting your endorphins up while you're doing it normally helps. So yeah.
Andrew (45:37.688)
So you have talked a lot about teaching children, whether it's in PE or whether it's at the dojo. Do you prefer to teach kids over adults?
Noah Dever (45:50.279)
I wouldn't, so I have more experience teaching kids than I do adults. I've only been teaching adults consistently for about two years now, and I teach them at the Barrington School. So I have a class there. And the big thing that I was always told is like, Craig looked at me in the adult class and I loved it. So I kind of took the philosophy of like,
Andrew (45:52.161)
Nah.
Andrew (45:57.378)
That's fair.
Noah Dever (46:19.705)
Adults go through enough on their day-to-day basis. Like, I'm 26 now. I live with my girlfriend. I have two jobs. I am off my parents' insurance now. Like, I'm paying for all this stuff out of pocket now. Or I'm on my own insurance. like, adults go through a lot on their day-to-day. They do not need a grown man.
Standing in the middle of the room going no do it again bar and some days they do but that's maybe like once a year for me Most of the time I'm just providing a space for them to learn skills and decompress like and Yes, they're learning a curriculum yes, they're There's expectations. There's rank. There's they have to be able to push through these things but 95 % of the time
providing a community for them to join rather than because at the end of the day The oldest student that I've had is 83 What life skill am I teaching an 83 year old like I am 26 years old like I it it it's all good like but I'm providing them a community in a space and I'm the keeper of that community and so my Responsibility is making sure that it is positive and inclusive to everyone
Andrew (47:20.462)
Hmm.
Andrew (47:47.32)
Mm-hmm.
Noah Dever (47:47.863)
And so it's a different role. So like, yes, I enjoy teaching kids because I get to be that mentor older brother, teach them the life skills kind of vibe. But I do enjoy teaching adults because it's like, no, this is this is our place that we've built together and we all get to. Just kind of blow off steam and learn. So, yeah.
Andrew (47:50.796)
Yeah.
Andrew (48:07.17)
Yep.
Andrew (48:14.966)
Yeah. So as you were talking, from the very beginning, the word that I kept hearing in my head, and you just mentioned it, was mentoring. You clearly were mentored as a child by, you've mentioned Craig and John.
Noah Dever (48:23.003)
Yeah. Yeah.
Noah Dever (48:30.949)
Yeah.
Andrew (48:32.904)
resonated so well with you that you took it upon yourself that this is an important thing for you, that you are mentoring. You're not just going in and teaching a PE class. You are mentoring. You're taking it to the next step. And I think that's amazing. I think it's important for
people listening to recognize that you have a huge impact on your students. If Craig and John were very different people, you would have turned out very differently.
Noah Dever (49:04.487)
100%. Yeah. And that's why I I've always gone back to, and this is something like as I've gotten older and I've matured slightly, they tell me that I have a fully developed frontal lobe now. I'm kind of hoping I still got some time, but we'll see. But like, it's not the style. Like I do kempo karate, but in reality, John is a...
Andrew (49:20.622)
Ha
Noah Dever (49:32.805)
referee that's reffed in the UFC. So I grew up thinking wrestling, BJJ, combat jiu-jitsu, American kickboxing, all that stuff was kempo. It didn't matter what style I was doing. I was learning from John. And at the end of the day, I don't think it's the style that matters because quite frankly, I am not a kicker. I'm
5'8 on a good day. I'm 200 pounds like I like me kicking getting my leg above my head is not gonna happen I'm much more of a wrestler build but I grew up in a striking art because I I felt valued and heard and loved by John and Craig and I Don't think it's the style. I think it's the instructor. This is so that's why if you are Craig keeps looking at me and going people don't leave a place where they feel valued and
And so if we just go out there and tell people that we love them, we value them, and we want to help them, life's going to be good, man. And we just got to keep doing that because that's what matters most to us.
Andrew (50:42.062)
And what's next for you? In your journey, what's next?
Noah Dever (50:46.727)
Golly. There is a lot. There is a lot of things. We'll see. I definitely running dojos eventually owning my own. That is a big goal. I've also toyed around with the idea of
If I go and I open up a school, I want to get it going running it and then if if the opportunity Presents itself. I would love to go and get a PhD in education. I think Actually doing the research on some of that stuff I'm a very I love English my brain works way too much like a scientist, but I love
like English class was my favorite. I feel very dichotomy, like two different people living in my own brain. My buddy Drake would say it's the Gemini in me, but we'll see. But I would love to go and teach PE teachers how to be teachers as well. Anywhere I go, I'm probably gonna end up teaching because it's just, at this point, it's what I'm...
Andrew (52:06.126)
Mm-hmm.
Noah Dever (52:11.779)
As John would put it, it's my God-given talent. It's what I was called on this planet to do, and I've been blessed with it. Sometimes it doesn't feel like a blessing, but you know what? That's with everything. And we'll see. So owning my own school, carrying on that KI tradition, because it changed my life, and I think it can do a lot for others too. And then...
Andrew (52:21.422)
you
Noah Dever (52:38.715)
Maybe being a martial artist with a PhD in education would be kind cool. know, the first MADC graduate to get his PhD in education come back and help make level 42 or something to MADC. You know. But, yeah.
Andrew (52:55.694)
That would be great. we'll start to wrap, wind it down here and I'll kick it back to you in just a second to, you know, close us out and leave the audience with something. But I just want to remind the audience of all the stuff that we do here at Whistlekick. You know, I failed to mention, I think at the beginning that if you are a school owner, you can go to whistlekick.com and find out information on joining Whistlekick Alliance.
which is our program just for school owners to help them better what they do. Or, you know, purchase something from our store using the code podcast one five and then joining patreon slash whistle kick, patreon.com forward slash whistle kick to help support what it is that we do to help us connect, educate and entertain traditional martial artists of the world in our goal to have everyone in the world train martial arts for six months.
So before we close out, Noah, how can people reach you if they are interested in what it is you're doing, especially with your PE program, and how can people connect with you?
Noah Dever (54:06.885)
Yeah, probably the easiest way to reach me would be my karate email. So that'd be noah, N-O-A-H, at Kymac, so K-I-M-A-C-N-H dot com. That's my work email. Definitely hit me up there. Facebook, I'm noadever. But yeah, no, those are probably the two places that I'm always happy to help because...
quite honestly, this is how we grow the arts. I've grown up with, we're always, Craig has always told me we're one generation away from the martial arts dying. And so it's our responsibility to keep it going. So if there's any way I can help you and the listeners, anybody, just hit me up. More than happy to help.
Andrew (54:58.296)
Cool. And what do you want to leave the audience with? Anything you want them to take away from our talk today?
Noah Dever (55:08.295)
Great question. Martial arts is for everybody. It might not be from you if you're a teacher and that's okay. everybody can benefit from martial arts. We just need to be creative. Some people need to be more creative than others and that's okay.
Andrew (55:09.558)
I only try and ask the great ones.
Noah Dever (55:34.999)
It's our responsibility as teachers and educators to make that happen. so help each other, love each other, and we'll make it work.