Episode 577 - Rapid Fire Q&A
In this episode, Jeremy and co-host Andrew Adams take on a Rapid Fire Question and Answers.
Rapid Fire Q&A - Episode 577
Jeremy and co-host Andrew Adams tackle a series of questions from you, the listeners, in the form of a Rapid Fire Q&A. Here are the questions they tried to answer:
Requirements of testing for 4th dan or Master’s Rank
Ways to build school morale during quarantine/lockdown
Thoughts on instructors being FRIENDS with students
Fitness drills and teaching techniques
Show Transcript
You can read the transcript below.
Jeremy Lesniak:
What's happening everybody? Welcome! This is whistlekick Martial Arts Radio episode 577 and today, Andrew and I will be doing a rapid-fire Q&A. Never done this before. We'll see how it goes. I'm excited. I'm Jeremy Lesniak joined of course by Andrew Adams over here at whistlekick and we do what we do because we love traditional martial arts. Everybody involved in whistlekick loves traditional martial arts. And if you're watching, there's a video of this. Or listening, there is a really good chance that you also love traditional martial arts and if you want to show that love, well that's an awkward sentence. We're going to leave it because it's a video. You can do a lot of things to show your love for the traditional martial arts and of course the work that we're doing. You can make a purchase at whistlekick.com using code PODCAST15, you could share an episode like this one with your friends who may not know about whistlekick yet or you could support our Patreon, patreon.com/whistlekick. It's one of the ways we offset the cost for the show. No, it doesn't pay Andrew but there's still plenty of things that go into this. I shouldn’t have said that. Maybe that's offensive to you, I'm sorry.
Andrew Adams:
No, it’s fine.
Jeremy Lesniak:
No, I am sorry. I don't I don't make any money on the show either. In fact, I pay a lot of money for the show. That's how much I love it. That's how important it is to me. Now, the show gets its own website it's whistlekickmartialartsradio.com. all of whistlekick, it's a separate website which is whistlekick.com. Go there, sign up for the newsletter, check out all the things we're involved in because we do a lot of stuff that's more than the show. This is the hard part about doing videos. I can't pause and have Julius send out. I've got these notes and I look at it as we do this and I'm just like I would forget but I got to roll with it. I mean this is behind the scenes as you get this raw video. We do this to connect, educate, and entertain the traditional martial artists of the world because I have a belief that martial arts makes people better. And that if we could get everybody in the world to train for just 6 months, the world would be a dramatically better place. That is the founding mission of whistlekick. So, there you go. Well, tribute time. Not trivia time. Why do I keep wanting to call this tribute because rapid fire trivia is something Gabe throws at us?
Andrew Adams:
Absolutely.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Rapid fire Q&A... And that is a self-selection so I don't get bogged down. It's been 45 minutes talking about a single topic.
Andrew Adams:
You and me both.
Jeremy Lesniak:
I like to talk, probably, why I host the show because I enjoyed talking. And you do too which is why I invited you to co-host a show.
Andrew Adams:
Yep, we enjoyed discussion of martial arts.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Well, we've got some questions here. We got some things we can chat about. And we're going to put a timer on it. We're going to put 5 minutes up. No, you're not going to see that on the video version because actually maybe Joyce will do that. I don't know we'll find out. But at the very least it is going to keep me honest. Make sure that I don't spend more than 5 minutes talking about any of these things. So, what do we get first? All right.
Andrew Adams:
So, the first topic was sent in by Matt and his suggestion for some to discuss really quickly is requirements for testing for fourth dan for masters’ rank. So, fourth degree black belt masters' rank. You know in taekwondo would be typically a master rank. What requirements for testing should that look like?
Jeremy Lesniak:
Tell me when to go.
Andrew Adams:
5 minutes, go.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Okay. So, first off. I'm not a big fan of the term ‘master’ because I think that it's a misnomer within the martial arts. I think mastery is a much higher level of competency than a fourth degree. And that is just based on the general time that it goes on. And I don't want to spend time digging into that but maybe that's another question for another time. When I think about someone who is in that fourth, fifth, sixth degree range. Right? It's not really black. Well, it's not first, not second, not third. If you spend much time in martial arts, you know that most people don't even make the black belt. What does it do? First degree black belts or equivalent some other style often fade away. I achieved my goal because the goal set in front of them was first degree. So, we look at the sheer number of people who achieve a first degree that don't make it to second. And it's huge. It's a large percentage. I know the date on that because I don't know that anybody's tracking data on that. Maybe, someday when we have a lot of money we can. But once you get the second, you are kind of saying okay I'm in this. And I see our smaller drop off between second and third and fourth. So, the question then is what is different for someone when they've earned a fourth degree? What I would call the beginning of middle black belt rank? That is not true of someone who is a, let's say, first, second or third. I think it's a couple things first. I think it is a deeper understanding of the non-physical aspects of the art. So, when I think about the people that I've known who earn a first-degree black belt, they have competency. They know how to do things. They have some understanding depending on the school system of why and maybe even when and how but they don't generally understand where things come from. And how to necessarily adapt to things that are not for them right. I'm a small person. I'm 5’7. There are things in the way I spar that someone who is 6’4 might not do and vice versa. I would imagine what I would say to someone who is a fourth-degree expert or approaching expertise on the path to expertise has an ability to empathize with other body types. Other sizes that are for people starting martial arts and they're able to take what they know and convey it to those people in a way that resonates. I think that's probably the biggest thing for me. I can teach someone 6’4. I can teach someone that is 6’4 or smaller. I can teach them how to utilize their assets such as the length of their limbs, their ability to get in and out of trouble when they are combative in a way that I will never be able to do. I understand intellectually. I can teach it or if you are checked up. So, a couple weeks ago, I can instruct it, maybe, but I don't understand it personally. It's a difference, it's an important difference. On top of that I think there is a commitment to progress. I think if you're going to earn such a fourth-degree black belt. I think the door gets; I think in most school systems the door is now wide open. There is unlikely to be anything that is held back. And it is up to you to invest your time, your energy and understanding as much as you can in what is being presented to you, like maybe a first reflection of the words. Okay, you've reached the top of that mountain and from the top of the mountain, you see holy cow. There's more by the time you get to fourth degree. Which you know why I am being vague is there are different schools. By the time you reset for this degree, you have climbed high enough that you can now get context for how much there is. Maybe, you're never going to reach the top of the mountain, maybe you will never fully understand and demonstrate expertise in the information that is available to you. But you have the ability to do so.
Andrew Adams:
Excellent. You had 15 seconds to spare. That was good.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Thank you. I'm trying to wrap it. I don't want you to cut me off. I know you don't, I get it but I've got to cut you off. We'll see what happens. We'll see. I can just talk faster if needed. I've given a lot of presentations to a lot of big rooms for a lot. You know with a lot of money at stake. This is what I have that doesn't usually surface on the show.
Andrew Adams:
See if you talk faster than the people that listen at 1.5 speed then it'll be too fast for them.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Well, I don't know. So, like I said the chipmunks.
Andrew Adams:
Or the micro machines guy. I'm dating myself…
Jeremy Lesniak:
Wow! I thought about making machines and like 20 years, we can have a conversation about that after the show. All right. Keep going.
Andrew Adams:
Okay, all right. So, next to this question that's about you brought up a few people and I think we don't know when I say “we”. you have done a bunch of episodes on training…
Jeremy Lesniak:
You are part of the team.
Andrew Adams:
Well, but you did them before I was on board. So, we still could have done a lot of episodes recently about training during covid. You know, it is something that has been here for 9 plus months at this point and that will be going away at some point. Hopefully, but, here's a question that I don't know that you could have done a lot on and it was brought up by a few people and ways to build school morale during quarantine.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah. So, this is where I can put more of the business consulting add on. For people who don't know, I do consult with some martial arts schools as part of the marketing business work that I do and that work is part of what props up whistlekick financially as we continue to find paths to profitability. And I'm thinking of one school in particular and I don't know if they want me to shout them out, so I'm not going to but he's probably listening and he knows I'm talking about it, so, shout out to my buddy there. We spent a lot of time on this because when you think about it, if you go back to the out of sequence episodes that are released at the beginning of lockdowns, I said what is the thing you have to convey so much value? What your school does has to be so valuable to people that they are desperate to hold on to it in any way they can to make sure that is there when they can train? Right? I believe we are going into an additional walk out. They think things are going to tighten up again. We're watching some of that internationally. I believe it is going to come here, so, I think if you're a school owner, pay close attention to what I'm about to say. Value and morale are not quite interchangeable but they correlate. What is morale? Morale is people's belief that what they are doing is worthwhile and makes them better. How do you keep your students motivated and excited and engaged? What you don't do might be the easier thing to say. You don't just show up on zoom and teach a class. If that's the only thing you do, there's a good chance you're not in the school anymore if you do that for the last 12 months. You have to adapt and part of the reason being vague is because what you do varies dramatically based on the art you do, the size of your school, the number of people you have helping you, the financial side of it, etc. For example, if you have a school where you've got a dozen assistant instructors, you could potentially have the work one on one via small groups on zoom. If you're a full time non martial arts instructor, you have a job and you're used to showing up in teaching a 90-minute class twice a week, you may not have the time to do that and may have to do things differently. So, what is it you do? The best example I can give of a morale booster that doesn't apply here is a barbecue out in the parking lot once a month after class. A potluck sort of thing. Getting people to recognize that martial arts and martial artists doesn't stop at the door when you are barred. The recognition that you are all individuals who value each other and finding ways to support that.
So, there are martial arts schools that have launched clubs. Thank you. Andrew is giving me a two minutes sign and at first, I was like there's only 2 schools that have done that? No, that's not right but I'm wrapping my mind around this for that. One of my sayings to my client is that the negative is a positive. What's the negative here? For so many people, it's online only. What's the positive? You have the ability to present anything from your computer and see people and record it. One of the things that I've seen both in and outside of the martial arts context that he searched since covid. Dungeon's dragons. Many people are playing DND right now, maybe that's not for you but it's a great example. It's a great example of finding ways for people to engage with each other. Learn about each other and develop who they are, build relationships as a result of their involvement in a martial arts school. And if you use that as an example, if you use, that is the goal. There are a lot of things you can do. Phone calls, emails, photos, all the things that maybe you kind of did for marketing purposes before. What if you put more of a personal bent on it? What if you give people the opportunity to be more involved in setting the direction and create more of a community feel? I think that's an important aspect to it. What if, you know, maybe you can't have the barbecue in the parking lot but what if, once a month, virtual barbecue, everybody shows up then sits down with their dinner and you chatted up. Maybe your school is too big and you can't do 200 people at once. So, you put them in groups. You randomly assigned people to 8,10,12 person groups. And say you know what, by the time we come back, you were all responsible for each other to make sure that you get back to class. You are responsible for driving each other's training, maybe you make a game out of it, maybe there's a point system which rewards. If you're creative, if you want to take a step back and recognize that the goal of a martial arts school is to develop a personal growth of people involved. Not necessarily just to teach how to put punching kicks. I think this becomes a lot easier to understand.
Andrew Adams:
Time. That was perfect. Now, granted, I gave you 15 extra seconds because you stopped to talk about my peace sign or two schools. So, I gave you extra because you know that. It was good.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Thank you.
Andrew Adams:
Excellent.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Anything you want to add?
Andrew Adams:
No, I don't want to go over. So, we're good. If I have a vastly different opinion than you, maybe I’ll say something but not. Pretty good. So here this leads into a question actually that I have brought up. And you, mentioning the barbecue social aspect of your school leads into this question and my question is what are your thoughts on instructors being friends with students?
Jeremy Lesniak:
You’re underscoring that word friends which is important.
Andrew Adams:
Yes, because there's a very, very discussed episode about relationships...
Jeremy Lesniak:
Rather divisive on romantic relationships within schools.
Andrew Adams:
Yes and that's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about friends.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Okay. So, one of my fundamental beliefs is that the majority of people cannot maintain multiple and distinct relationships with a single person. This is why it's really hard for people to be, you know, back when I had a computer company, it was hard for me to be friends with my employees. Because to go out have a beer with them and be peers and then to step back into the job and... Maybe you know their boss, it was really hard and usually was hard for me ultimately. I got better at that but it still remains hard for the employees. You know it's a little bit easier based on my management staff to give people some leeway but it was tough for them and I think the same thing applies in a martial art setting. When I think of instructors who, I've done this well. It's not frequent. And it usually has the context of a martial arts event. So, like a summer camp martial art. Summer camp where maybe at the end of the weekend or the end of the day within meals, they'll take off their martial arts uniform, they're wearing street clothes like most people are and they may or may not depending on who's there in the formality permit being called by their first name. But it can also be really difficult if you've been training a while, you have an instructor you've spent a long time with. If you're used to calling him Mr., Mrs. or sensei, it can become really challenging to switch those names back and forth. So is it necessarily bad? No but it requires boundaries and requires both people fully understanding what those boundaries are. Together being on the same page and respecting them. So, let's have a martial arts school. I go out. I have a beer with the crew after we train, you sit down, you know, we're, let's say, there's you know a dozen of us and we're at a big table at a chain restaurant. I am not going to ask them to call me anything. I'm just going to let it hang. Most of them are probably going to call me with the term I prefer “sensei” so most of them are probably still going to call me sensei. I'm not going to correct them on that because I want them to be comfortable. I'm not going to be dramatically different in the way that I present myself. For example, I would never swear and rarely swear in the context of teaching martial arts. In my personal day to day life, I kind of have the vocabulary of a sailor but I'm not going to do that when I'm at a bar having a drink with my students. Because I don't want them to have to work hard to switch back and forth between Jeremy, the teacher and Jeremy, not the teacher. Could I write it out and say hey? here are the rules if I'm going to do this. But... first. I'm sure other people watching or listening think I'm overreacting. And I would almost guarantee that 100 percent of those people have never had someone transition from student to friend. And then disrespecting them in the midst of a class includes everything that you're building at risk. That's the challenge. It’s not the problem when it goes right, the problem is when it goes wrong. The problem is when you talk to your friend and then they use that information either willingly or without being aware. Within class, they make a joke at your expense. Something to that effect and it can be really destructive and it can put other people around you in a really tough situation. And it sucks because there's a good chance, the people who love martial arts are the people you want to be friends with. It's probably the thing you have most in common and if somebody's passionate about martial arts they have a lot in common. There’s probably ton you could talk about. But it doesn't always work out and in fact I would say that inevitably because there's a chance it's not going to work out given enough time. It will never work. There will always be something that pops up for everyone when I think about the instructors of people that I love, I think very highly of, I've screwed up at some point with almost every one of them. Given enough time I probably would. Especially, putting a beer in my hand. Alcohol reduces inhibitions and makes people think that things are okay and aren't okay. So, if you're going to do it, be careful and maybe even write out some guidelines and maybe even share them with the students so everybody knows what's going on.
Andrew Adams:
Awesome. Good job. 5 minutes exactly. Another one right on the button. All right. You ready for the last one?
Jeremy Lesniak:
Let’s do it.
Andrew Adams
This was sent in through our Facebook from Daniel and his question is how much for class should be aimed at fitness drills rather than teaching technique and does this differ if you're thinking about kids or adults? Hang on. Ready? Go.
Jeremy Lesniak:
I think it depends greatly on the stated goal of the class so I could teach. You know what, let's say I'm teaching karate. I could teach karate as a fitness class. I can teach karate as a self-defense class. I can teach karate in a competitive class. Same techniques can be the same body of information. I'm going to use different amounts of it in different contexts to get different goals. When someone says how do you teach kids versus adults, I actually don't teach that differently. I start with fun. If it's enjoyable people will come back. If they don't come back, it doesn't work. And sometimes people hear that and they'll initially reject what I'm saying but you know, you got to be serious and effective. I've had a ton of fun getting punched in the face. My people that I really value in the call-in certain contexts. Right? Serious martial arts can also be fun. Genuine, legitimate, effective self-defense applicable martial arts can be a tremendous amount of fun. I've been doing as long as they have without having fun doing it. I didn't invest everything I own and have an exam into a company that supports traditional martial arts without thinking it's a ton of fun that would be ridiculous. Now, what a 4-year-old finds fun and what a 50-year-old finds fun are probably a little different. I'm probably going to use fewer... Here's a great example: the way I teach in Japanese [00:23:02-00:23:06] whatever you want to call it. The way I teach the kids uses a lot of animals or monster personification. I'm probably not going to do that with a 50-year-old. They're probably not going to resonate as well when I say “all right, I want you to think of the scariest monster you can and when I say go, you're going to shout as loud as you can”. For 50-year Olds, I'm going to have more of a philosophical discussion. I'm going to get them to do some more of that thought process internally because kids are much more willing to have fun yelling and being loud than most adults are. I can still make it fun the way we're going to teach, let’s say, stances. I might use different vocabulary; I might use different goals. I might break things down differently. You got to keep kids moving. The moment the kid stops moving, you're done. You can't have a philosophical discussion with a group of 4-year Olds. They're going to eat you. Maybe if you're bad enough, literally bite you. I've seen it happen, not to me but I've seen it happen. So, when we talk about how to get these goals across, you have to work backwards from the what's the purpose of the class, why your people are there. Understanding why they are there. Making sure they're enjoying themselves and then breaking things up in such a way that it resonates for the majority of people within the context of what you've presented to them. If you just tell them “Hey, we have a martial arts class”. They're potentially all there for different reasons. You're going to have people who are there for self-defense. You have other people who are there for fitness. So, in that context, it becomes making sure there's enough of everything that everyone finds progress among something that is important to them. If you have someone come into a school that is really hell bent on doing forms, my love forms but that person doesn't love forms. If 3 quarters of the class, every class' forms, probably going to lose that person. But if once in a while, 3 quarters of that class is something else that makes them happy, did they really feel passion about and they can see progress in themselves that's the key. Then that's how you go on with it. May have been a little bit dodgy, my answer because there are so many opportunities for different specifics but I'm hoping that I put that forward in a way that is understandable for people given different context. Did I do that, Andrew?
Andrew Adams:
Yes, I think so. I mean you came around. In the middle, there is a little like okay but he's asking about how much of the class should be aimed towards fitness or other stuff but you came out of the end and said that it varies depending on what your students in the class are expecting. You know, I've never been to, I'm going to date myself again, I've never been to a Billy Blanks’ karate class but I suspect his classes are a little more fitness oriented.
Jeremy Lesniak:
I would say they are maybe; they weren't back in the day…
Andrew Adams:
And you know, maybe, you'll find out because maybe you'll do an interview with someone who trained with Billy Blanks.
Jeremy Lesniak:
And try to get Billy blanks on the show.
Andrew Adams:
I might be able to help…
Jeremy Lesniak:
That would be awesome. The ‘why’ matters; people forget how important the whys. Everything you do works backwards from the why and if you don't know what the why is, it's time to put that down and understand it. If you’re a martial arts instructor and you don't know why your students are there, find out, talk to them. Don't take their reasons there for granted. Information is never bad.
Andrew Adams:
Excellent.
Jeremy Lesniak:
That was it?
Andrew Adams
That was it. It was good. I ask for questions, you answer them. I gave you 5 minutes. You took 5 minutes, which is also good.
Jeremy Lesniak:
All right let's. Let's close this thing out. All right, so if you want to ask a question, best place, jumping on the Facebook whistlekick Martial Arts Radio behind the scenes group. You can ask a question there. Andrew, I’m sure as we try to get this format going a little bit stronger, you'll post in there again to ask people for these sorts of questions.
Andrew Adams:
Great, yep.
Jeremy Lesniak:
When this one goes live, it's 577. You'll be able to find it in there and just so people know, like you can always go back and search whistlekickmartialartsradio.com. You can search there, you know, there's a lot of stuff going on with these shows that will give you more context. You know with the interviews, we've got photos and links and all kinds of stuff like that and most importantly, if you want to help us out, you want to support what we're doing to help offset some of the costs, make a purchase at whistlekick.com. Throw some money at the patreon, tell other people about it so we can grow. So, hopefully, they will buy something or throw money at the patreon. right. We are a community and we are a community of passionate traditional martial artists who want, I won’t say everybody wants, I want everybody to feel engaged and supported in their training because I think that makes it more likely that people will remain training.Martial arts are better people. You see somebody out there wearing a whistlekick, stop, say hi. Follow us on social media we’re @whistlekick everywhere. My email’s jeremywhistlekick.com and throw me guest suggestions, feedback, topic suggestions, and will share with Andrew. And that's it. So, thanks for joining us and until next time train hard, train hard, smile and have a great day.